I don't disagree.

I would embrace the new/different challenges that comes with hunting with a new weapon with new capabilities. As you mention it is more technical in nature when factors like bullet/load/caliber choice, wind and bullet drop come into play.

I would approach it like every other weapon I have hunted with. Know my personal and weapons limits, practice, practice, practice and be confident in my ability to make a quick one shot humane kill when the opportunity presents itself.

If this passes, I really don't think that the vast majority of hunters are going to be taking 300-1000 yard shots like they do on TV. Just like I don't think the vast majority of bow hunters take 60-80 yard shots like many TV hunters do.

In this state the rifles would help on long range shots yes. Over fields, power line cuts etc, but most of the hunting in southern Indiana they would be no real advantage because of the cover we have. Here in southeast indiana i would prefer my slug gun any day.

[ [/qb][/QUOTE]If this passes, I really don't think that the vast majority of hunters are going to be taking 300-1000 yard shots like they do on TV. Just like I don't think the vast majority of bow hunters take 60-80 yard shots like many TV hunters do. [/QB][/QUOTE]

I just believe there a lot, lot more, goofy guys out there during firearms taking goofy shots then there are with bows. Therein comes the materiality of the situation. What I would suggest if this passes is folks need to be even more careful when hunting ground blinds.

delaney Can't hurt to be more careful....That's for sure.

Just makin it easier and easier which leads to more license sales. Of course it will pass because it means more money. You have to think and assume over 70% of the population wants to shoot deer not actually hunt them.

Change "taking" to "making" in your sentence and I'll agree with it. In my experience, distance seldom stops some folks from spraying lead in the general direction of deer. All those misses end up somewhere....

Frankly, this says it all.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.....

Have a nice evening.

some just go out to fill their freezers.

We all hunt for different reasons.

Have to admit there is a difference in hunting and shooting. A guy who buys a slug gun night before season and just goes out and sits with a case of beer is a deer shooter not a hunter. That's his right but just not the kinda guy I want to be compared to.

I don't see how you figure that it's a person's right to sit and drink beer with a firearm in his hands under the guise of hunting.

IMHO, a guy like that would be a drunken idiot and as dangerous as people who drink and drive.

Yes I agree but I worked in two different sporting goods stores for close to 10 years and every year those guys came in and I had I hear that. A few heated discussions with a few of those clowns almost leading to my dismissal. I'm not justifying it kind I like I don't justify drinking and driving but I can't stop it, guess I worded it wrong. I don't condone or agree with it but my opinion on what someone else doesn't shouldn't mean anything to them. Idiots are idiots plain an simple. But in the eyes or the non hunting community that drunken idiot hunter is no different than someone who does it the right way. I'll try an keep this on topic now, I see no need for center fire rifles and I if passes will not choose to use one. But Dnr will follow the money and we will see it pass.

if they are just added to the list of legal firearms for our existing firearms season there is no new revenue for the IN DNR

Unless they add a new season or new license (like they did with crossbows), I see no significant financial upside to the DNR for this.

Tell that to my deer-legal .300 Blackout AR-15 PISTOL with scary, baby-killing silencer attached.



I, myself, prefer bowhunting, and if firearms hunting were ever completely banned in Indiana, my life would still go on. Yet I am still a strong proponent for legalizing all rifles .243" and larger for deer.

what is the price tag on something like this???

Actually not too bad IF you start with a bare receiver. If you build it as a pistol FIRST, it can be switched back and forth between pistol and rifle configurations legally at will. But if it left the factory as a rifle, it must stay a rifle.

So, since this started life as a pistol, I can use it as a pistol for two weeks in firearms deer season, then as a rifle the rest of the year, by simply adding a 16"+ barrel and buttstock. That way, it's not an expensive two-week-a-year "toy".

AR-15 rifles and pistols cost about the same to build, so figure a grand or less for an average build. Add in another $600 for the suppressor pictured and $200 for the NFA tax stamp.

All I want to know is when does hand grenade season start?

Probably as soon as enough "hunters" want it in Indiana.

No comment ;0) .....

Dave, with your use of quotes, are you insinuating that those who want to use high-powered rifles for deer aren't real hunters?

Nope. But at some point, in my opinion, there is a line between hunting and simply shooting and simply killing. Be it a high powered rifle, shotgun, crossbow or bow, a guy that picks one up one and then simply goes out and shoots the first thing that they see, simply went hunting and in that sense he was really hunting as a hunter. But, I believe there is a significant difference between that type of hunter and someone who engages throughout the year, targets a specific animal or two and then seeks to harvest them. My comments aren't intended to be critical, although I'm sure some will wish to make them such. Hunting can be accomplished by the use of all sorts of weapons, including the hand grenade. But again, do I believe there is different kinds of hunting and different kinds of hunters, yes I do. As I said in another post, I will really trap this year but in my own definition of being a real trapper, that being someone who engages, analyzes and specifically pursues, I certainly wouldn't consider myself a real trapper. I don't get offended by others opinions or beliefs whether I agree with them or not. And I'm not one who would get offended if someone said I wasn't a "real" deer hunter, duck hunter, turkey hunter, fisherman or whatever else. Everyone defines it differently. But as I would define the use of "real" in front of the word deer hunter, I don't believe many if not most guys who go to the field are "real" deer hunters, even though they are really deer hunting. No differently then if I played football today, I wouldn't consider myself a "real" football player.

I say that if you hunt, you are a hunter; if you fish, you are a fisherman; if you trap, you are a trapper, etc. I don't consider levels of proficiency when adding the adjective "real" in front of those terms. If you partake in any of those activities, then you are "real" in my book.

I would guess that most feel the same as you do in the use of the adjective "real". I see it a bit differently. I don't really care what the DNR does or what legal weapon guys use. I do tend to assess the accomplishment relative to the process or manner used to achieve the accomplishment. But that in itself isn't meant to suggest one weapon user is a better person then someone else using a different weapon.

Bring on the rifles ...... 'Cause I know what that will bring next.

But then again..... "It" is coming anyways....

The all knowing is back with his predictions of the future.

If there are no valid reasons to restrict freedom then why would we do it?

Please give defensible reasons for restricting the use of rifles in deer season in Indiana. By "defensible" I mean supported by fact and data and not opinion and judgement.

What John Scifres said. Couldn't have said it better.

I'd absolutely use one. Rarely do I gun hunt but I'd use one when or if I did. Usually I am fortunate enough to tag w a bow.

I also really hope Mr Scarlett Dew is right w his predictions.

John, while I understand where you are coming from, freedom is not all encompassing. Even within freedom, there are limits, restrictions and such. For instance, should we then allow bait piles, allow snaring of deer, let people hunt from a moving vehicle. My point is only that "defensible" is not typically used in many, many aspects of the rules of society.

Many of us have figured for years that "It" might happen. After all...I learned long ago to never say never.

But despite the same self assured predictions year after year after year, not only has "It" not happened, it now appears that it may very well be a few more years before "It" has a chance of happening. So I don't see the point in fretting about "It" right now.

But even if "It" does come to pass (in whatever form "It" ends up taking). I highly doubt that "It" will have the effect some seem to think it will.

And regardless of what does/doesn't happen with "It", (like many) I'll enjoy having access to the varied (and possibly growing) equipment choices that have come our way during the last several years.

If "it" happens, "it" will put more mature bucks in the woods. That is fact, not debate.

"It" won't make those bucks stupid. Mature bucks are mature bucks, not easy targets.

"It" won't make you a better deer hunter...but "it" will increase the odds of anyone with a tag getting lucky once in awhile.

For the doubters, "it" likely won't have the same effect "it" will have for others. After all, they are doubters for a reason.

Well...if "It" goes through....(and that appears to still be a big if @ this time) and if "It" doesn't have the desired effect (thus making a certain segment of hunters very unhappy), one has to wonder who or what will get the blame then?

Will it be....Too many hunters? Politicians? The DNR? Chad Stewart? Gun hunters? Crossbow hunters? Meat hunters? Too many bonus antler less permits? The late antler less season? Insurance companies? Too many depredation permits? Too many does? Too few antler less permits? Not enough counties included in the late archery season? Too late of a start to bow season? The youth season?

All of the above?

Only time will tell....

I am with Dave on this with a High Powered Rifle where I Hunt It would be Killing not hunting that with the fact I am not a huge trophy hunter

Delaney,

You didn't give a reason. What is it? Simple question. No subtleties or straw man arguments required.

John, I think you missed my intended point. No "reason" for it or against it. Which I would suggest makes either a justified position or one position of greater value or importance over the other. No argument intended but when you suggest "data", that tends to move the discussion to a much broader perspective. Opinion and positions be what they may, but data is often not relative to a final outcome. My reason, if I have to give a reason, is that I would prefer to maintain a stronger sense of hunting, as opposed to shooting or killing and I believe looking at the bigger picture is more important then one small issue at a time, which I believe this to be.

And John, if your approach is a no valid reason approach, then would you also suggest that if folks wish to, they be allowed to snare deer, hunt from a vehicle or pursue other methods that there isn't real data or reasons to restrict? Not trying to argue at all, just trying to understand if you believe deer management should pretty much become such based upon having to have a reason for not allowing something.

There is no way to argue against this latest proposal without sounding like an elitist azz ... so why not swing for the fence.

It is target shooting plane and simple. It is not hunting.

We have become a society that simply holds our hand out when we feel that life needs to be made easier and in the name of political correctness, we get what we want. So it should not surprise anyone when hunters want it to be easier to kill a deer. It won't end with rifles either.

Anything to make it easier to kill the all mighty whitetail deer.

I may not agree with you, but I respect the fact that you gave your honest opinion.

OK. I thought you had a position. I am not interested in philosophizing. It gets too messy here. Come share a campfire with me. I am hosting a traditional archery bowhunt Oct. 3-5 in Jackson-Washington SF. We can philosophize all night long

8th Annual Southern IN Bowhunt