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Re: 10 reasons #5636
01/28/2014 06:58 AM
01/28/2014 06:58 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 807
Martinsville Indiana
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HS Strut Offline
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HS Strut  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Martinsville Indiana
Quote
Originally posted by Yaz:
Quote
Originally posted by HS Strut:
[b] Based on my beliefs that if I own it, I should be able to use it the way I want to... to make money such as leasing it to hunters, farming it, raising animals on it... it should not be illegal. And since nobody wants to step out and say how big the enclosure has to be before it becomes ethical to hunt it, I guess we have some more work to do?
If you lived next door to me, would you want me to put in a hog confinement? Would you want me to put in a shooting range? You telling me you wouldn't fight this in the process? How about a landfill? Don't want me to go hungry would you? I can use my property as I see fit…right?

Or if you were a legitimate cattle farmer, would you want one of these places right next door to you when they have a TB outbreak, and it affects YOUR business? Or your hunting ground is right next door, and one of their CWD infected deer get out and your hunting area has to be depopulated? Remember, these guys historically have not been made held accountable for their screw ups…….YOU foot the bill.

My point is, I can agree with you to a certain point. But, when it affects others negatively, (which these places eventually will), that's where the line needs to be drawn on what a guy can do with his own property.

Maybe one thing people may not realize. If CWD is found in a facility, it SHOULD always be considered "contaminated". This is a prion, and no known way to get rid of it. It stays in the soils, and they have now found that it can be taken up by plants and ingested. Which means, if a CWD infected animal is brought in and turned loose on a property, then there is a chance that the others could be infected. So, just getting rid of the carrier animal, does nothing! Also, anything hauled in the trailer it was brought in with in the middle of the night, could stand the same chance. [/b]
Quote
No Yaz, I wouldn't be happy about any of the above scenarios. I agree that we need some laws to protect us from our neighbors doing us harm.
I'm just sick of government telling us what we Can and Can't do. A fella moving in next door and hurting your property value is sometimes just a fact of life. A landfill? That would suck. I just hate where this country is heading.

My neighbors german shepherd practically ate my wifes lap dog. After surgery and some painful medical bills, Our dog lived. Neighbor came over to apologize. I told him "It's OK. Doo Doo Happens. But if it happens again, I'll put a 1oz slug through your shepherd, gut it, hang it out back for your kids to see and then sell it to the chinese restaurant in town."
His dog has been to obedience training, a dog whisperer AND best I can tell is now an inside dog. No new law or government intervention needed.

It's funny because my neighbor is the one who convinced me that I'm really(like him) a libertarian. I think the only laws we should have are laws against people doing harm to one another. NO laws to aid businesses. No IRS. No Bailouts. Free country. Free to prosper. Free to fail.

As far as this canned hunting thing goes? I say we caused this ourselves with our obsession with antlers. I myself can shoulder some of the blame, although I've never leased or been obsessed with big bucks. Can we blame a guy for wanting to cash in? It may ruin hunting as we know it. But lots of thing threaten it every day.
Sounds to me like we are going to have to "Regulate" these idiots. I hate it. But it's where we're heading.

Re: 10 reasons #5637
01/28/2014 08:52 AM
01/28/2014 08:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,525
owen county
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gundude Offline
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owen county


Life is hard. Its even harder If your stupid!
John Wayne.
Re: 10 reasons #5638
01/28/2014 09:01 AM
01/28/2014 09:01 AM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 75
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Bowmadness Offline
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Seems to me that it is inevitable and the only real way to control it is to legislate to requirements to reduce the threat of CWD. I'm really on the fence with this one. The ethical hunter in me cringes at the thought of someone hunting in a high fence. On the other hand, do we really want a horn porn seeking jackarse in the woods taking potshots? We can't have it both ways. I do retain the right however, to buy land next to or near all of these facilities and put in my "coyote farms". Coyotes that may or may not ironically get out from time to time.

Re: 10 reasons #5639
01/28/2014 03:23 PM
01/28/2014 03:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,751
Fishers, IN USA
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DNA Offline
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Fishers, IN USA
Quote
Originally posted by Steiny:
I have no issue with it. No different that put and take pheasant hunts or pay pond fishing in my mind.
If the birds can not fly and run away from you or if you snag fish or shoot them then there is no difference.

If you do not see a problem with this then I would say you are not interested in hunting or being a sportsman but simply are a killer and enjoy killing animals. To hunt, one need to seek out and find. There is no hunting about this industry. No pride in accomplishment, little to no skill required. One pays for a trophy that he has not the skill to aquire.

We have no outdoor ethic anymore.


"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..."

THEODORE ROOSEVELT
Re: 10 reasons #5640
01/28/2014 03:25 PM
01/28/2014 03:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,525
owen county
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gundude Offline
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owen county
This_^^^_^^
Well said Doug!


Life is hard. Its even harder If your stupid!
John Wayne.
Re: 10 reasons #5641
01/28/2014 03:40 PM
01/28/2014 03:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,586
Cass County
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Steiny Offline
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Posts: 1,586
Cass County
Didn't say I cared to participate in high fence deer hunting. Said I don't have a problem with it.

I've been on one of those put and take bird hunts and also fished a couple pay lakes over the years, mostly as a social thing out of curiosity.

Many of the pheasants and chukar we jumped and shot had to be kicked to fly, and at most of those pay ponds you can catch a fish with anything you dip in the water. These activities are terribly unsporting and I won't participate in them again either, yet they are still perfectly legal.

The notion that those fish or birds have some sort of sporting chance to get away is ridiculous, same deal with the high fenced deer.

I don't understand why the deer is put on a pedestal as if it is somehow more sacred than those other animals that get killed in an unsporting fashion daily?

Re: 10 reasons #5642
01/28/2014 05:04 PM
01/28/2014 05:04 PM
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,376
Indianapois, IN, USA
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delaney Offline
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Indianapois, IN, USA
Your last paragraph Steiny is the slippery slope. There is the absolute, which is the birds can escape if they have a mind to. But then there is the reality, as you suggest.


"Fishing is like a one night stand, unless you're fly fishing, then you've encountered the romance of your life"
Re: 10 reasons #5643
01/28/2014 05:12 PM
01/28/2014 05:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,751
Fishers, IN USA
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DNA Offline
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Fishers, IN USA
Quote
Originally posted by HS Strut:
Quote
Originally posted by Yaz:
[b]
Quote
Originally posted by HS Strut:
[b] Based on my beliefs that if I own it, I should be able to use it the way I want to... to make money such as leasing it to hunters, farming it, raising animals on it... it should not be illegal. And since nobody wants to step out and say how big the enclosure has to be before it becomes ethical to hunt it, I guess we have some more work to do?
If you lived next door to me, would you want me to put in a hog confinement? Would you want me to put in a shooting range? You telling me you wouldn't fight this in the process? How about a landfill? Don't want me to go hungry would you? I can use my property as I see fit…right?

Or if you were a legitimate cattle farmer, would you want one of these places right next door to you when they have a TB outbreak, and it affects YOUR business? Or your hunting ground is right next door, and one of their CWD infected deer get out and your hunting area has to be depopulated? Remember, these guys historically have not been made held accountable for their screw ups…….YOU foot the bill.

My point is, I can agree with you to a certain point. But, when it affects others negatively, (which these places eventually will), that's where the line needs to be drawn on what a guy can do with his own property.

Maybe one thing people may not realize. If CWD is found in a facility, it SHOULD always be considered "contaminated". This is a prion, and no known way to get rid of it. It stays in the soils, and they have now found that it can be taken up by plants and ingested. Which means, if a CWD infected animal is brought in and turned loose on a property, then there is a chance that the others could be infected. So, just getting rid of the carrier animal, does nothing! Also, anything hauled in the trailer it was brought in with in the middle of the night, could stand the same chance. [/b]
Quote
No Yaz, I wouldn't be happy about any of the above scenarios. I agree that we need some laws to protect us from our neighbors doing us harm.
I'm just sick of government telling us what we Can and Can't do. A fella moving in next door and hurting your property value is sometimes just a fact of life. A landfill? That would suck. I just hate where this country is heading.

My neighbors german shepherd practically ate my wifes lap dog. After surgery and some painful medical bills, Our dog lived. Neighbor came over to apologize. I told him "It's OK. Doo Doo Happens. But if it happens again, I'll put a 1oz slug through your shepherd, gut it, hang it out back for your kids to see and then sell it to the chinese restaurant in town."
His dog has been to obedience training, a dog whisperer AND best I can tell is now an inside dog. No new law or government intervention needed.

It's funny because my neighbor is the one who convinced me that I'm really(like him) a libertarian. I think the only laws we should have are laws against people doing harm to one another. NO laws to aid businesses. No IRS. No Bailouts. Free country. Free to prosper. Free to fail.

As far as this canned hunting thing goes? I say we caused this ourselves with our obsession with antlers. I myself can shoulder some of the blame, although I've never leased or been obsessed with big bucks. Can we blame a guy for wanting to cash in? It may ruin hunting as we know it. But lots of thing threaten it every day.
Sounds to me like we are going to have to "Regulate" these idiots. I hate it. But it's where we're heading. [/b]
We had libertarian wildlife management and we killed everything till there was no more. Had we continued with Libertarian wildlife management you would have never enjoyed the sport and this board would not have existed.


"It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..."

THEODORE ROOSEVELT
Re: 10 reasons #5644
01/29/2014 05:08 AM
01/29/2014 05:08 AM
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 807
Martinsville Indiana
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HS Strut Offline
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HS Strut  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 807
Martinsville Indiana
Good Point DNA

Re: 10 reasons #5645
01/31/2014 01:55 PM
01/31/2014 01:55 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 115
S.W.Indiana
PoseyCoHunter Offline
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PoseyCoHunter  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 115
S.W.Indiana
High fence hunting is not hunting it is just killing. You as a hunter don't get to learn the natural movement of the prey. You might as well hunt cows out of a farm field.

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