lets get back to the numbers...... and the questions....will they back off on the **** antlerless tags and move counties to at least a 3 anlerless county so that **** late season gun antlerless is in effect, or will they continue on their path of decline?.....remember they(DNR) want to see drops of 10% or more, isnt that correct ?.....

I found my answer!!
and your right that needs fixed some how!!

Guess a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then.

Add the bucks who had dropped and the button bucks from that season for two years.

2012 249 bucks who had dropped and 1,529 button bucks.
2013 168 bucks who had dropped and 1,024 button bucks.

That is a total of 2,970 bucks lost needlessly to this special antlerless season which is intended to target does.

It is pathetic that either hunters of that season do not care what the intent of the season is or that they are that blind that they cannot take a few seconds and verify their intended target.

good point and well supported by the data.

I for one did not participate in this season the past 2 years.

I dont plan on participating in it at all.... at least not in Porter. Co. and 'prolly never in any county.......Heck, in past years during the ML season, I passed on deer 'cause I couldnt positively ID a Button buck/shed buck from a Doe.....that happened to JB as he had wrote....I pretty much quit hunting with the ML then and went back to the bow so they'd be closer and easier to ID.....

There is going to be the "oops" deer every once in a great while. But ... nearly 20%?!?! That right there tells you that the hunters don't care about the plan or what animal it is that they are shooting. "As long as it is legal ... SHOOT!"

Just because something is legal, does not mean it is right.

Personally, I've not killed a button or drop antler deer in probably 20+ years. I'm pretty firm on when in doubt, don't shoot. I've killed some small yearling does in recent years and in every case I was 99.9% sure that I was shooting a doe and not a button.

I refuse to participate in the states special doe slaughter season.

What happens if a hunter shoots a buck during this season. Is it just, oops, my bad? Or are there consequences. Forgive my ignorance on this.

If there are no antlers then its legal.

as long as it is a "shed buck" or one tine under 3", it is OK under DNR rules....

Well, can we all agree that seems pretty stupid. Lol

That rule goes for all seasons!!

looks like as group there where around 14,000 BB killed this year across all seasons!!

Its not all about Buck hunting to everyone that goes to the Woods, Its Not a sin to Kill a BB. This condescending attitude on a DEER hunters choice is not very Nice thing for the Sport, IMO 70,000 Pounds Donated and thats all burger, around 2ooo deer killed just because someone wanted to kill something and didnt want the meat to me thats a bigger problem than killing a bb and eating it

I personally wasn't trying to make a statement against shooting button bucks. I was more meaning from a biological/herd reduction standpoint. If in late antlerless a county had 50/50 bucks to does taken, then the remaining does kicked off fawns the following spring, you are at net zero. If some have twins, you still have grown the herd. So it maybe isn't the most effective way to reduce the herd, being that is the goal. The fact that it is so late increases the odds of a shed buck being taken. Distinguishing a button buck during any of the seasons can be difficult, and I certainly wouldn't fault anyone if they killed one for meat.

perhaps they killed it just so someone else could have the meat.

Why is giving meat to those in need a problem?

Go volunteer at a distribution site like I did and make your own conclusion.. thats all I am saying on this

It's like an unwanted deer orphanage, for the most part.

X-3

This can be a touchy subject. I've never donated deer to this program and never will. I'm not a fan shooting deer and giving them away. And I'm certainly not a fan of shooting just for the "fun" of shooting, a deer. Now, my thought is that its great giving money to a program to feed people.

Yep....

At the Expo last weekend C.J. Winand why giving a presentation he said the Greatest tool the hunter has against the Anti's is the FHFH (Farmers and Hunters Feeding the Hungry)


"What can the anti-hunters say when they see pictures of homeless and under privileged children being fed venison? We know all too well how the hunting community seems to lose the battle of "emotions" that those opposed to hunting push to the general public. The FHFH program produces a win-win situation that even those opposed to hunting have a difficult time criticizing."

"Research has found that 80 percent of all non-hunters approve of hunting as long as the meat is being utilized. This is reflected whenever a deer sharp-shooting program must be initiated to help control numbers of deer in a given area. Nothing addresses public concern for animals like using the meat to feed hungry children and families. Again-emotion sells! "

link...
www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&es...r7gZ88GDtZRwKRL9aA&bvm=bv.62286460,d.aWc

Well you could take them hunting and teach them so they can feed themselves... Or at the very least is they could purchase a tag with their name and the name of the hunter shooting it for them... At least they would be contributing to the DNR....

Though donating is a noble thing but it has its own set of problems and one that Throbak pointed out...

I will always believe in this old adage: "Give a man a fish, and he will eat for a day... Teach him to fish, and he will eat for a lifetime!"...

Like most things, when you really start to do the math it becomes a bit clearer....

Using the numbers provided and given the number of counties in Indiana (92) that works out to about 20 deer per county.

I really don't see this as much of an issue.

I have in years past donated deer to a family in need. I have not used the HFH program as I usually have it processed and given to them. I am around people all the time that for some reason life has punched them in the mouth. I will do it again if need be and not hesitate nor feel guilty from other people by my choice.

I'll do as bean does.....give it away myself if someone needs it.

I agree. If the meat is being used, why does it matter? I attempt to donate at least one deer a year. If attempting to help a family stock their freezer with a little wild game makes me a bad person in the eyes of some, then so be it.

Just so I'm not misunderstood, I don't think giving meat to a needy person makes you bad person at all...

If only we were as concerned about our upland game birds........Grouse Quail and Pheasant.

We have lost our grouse season next year and the forseeable future..... quail is next!

But few care.....

The problem with the upland game birds is loss of habitat, AKA as uncut fields overgrown fencerows & the this brush farmers used to have growing between fields. In other words we are being too clean & tidy with nature. Come on it is nature let nature take care of it, she can do a better job than we can.

I will give/share meat to others as Ive already done this year, but I wont shoot an extra deer just to donate it....

This says it all. Sadly, there are many who will speak up for deer but there are few who will speak up for the rest of wildlife and conservation in general. And it won't end until we have further diminished water quality via loss of more and more habitat that affects not only wildlife but fisheries. as well. Its why "hunters" need to literally drop the hunter or hunters word from their organizations and start new organizations whose primarily focus is conservation and habitat whereby they can then also support hunting and fishing as recreation, a society benefit and management tool. If hunters don't change their future focus to conservation, there will eventually be little to hunt because loss of habitat will affect everything.

The reality is that farmers are trying to get every bushel out of every acre and this means clearing brushy fence rows, tilling right to the edge of woods, putting land back in production, etc.

We may not agree this choice, and it's consequences for gamebirds, For most of us though our paycheck or livelihood is not at stake here.

Agree 76, but the difficulty I have with some of this is the government subsidy that encourages margin land farming. Additionally, more and more of the farms are being purchased by large Wall Street trusts and the "paycheck" issue, while still relevant, isn't quite the same as that of small farmers. My brother and I are selling a farm to a large land trust that unfortunately will likely remove as much of the woods and habitat as possible. Kind of makes me part of the problem.

Keeping up with the title of this thread....the National Lakeshore is up to 150 deer killed this winter using their sharpshooters....the harsh winter has pulled more deer into their corn piles.....they ARE the "brown and down" crowd....they will kill any deer that walks....fawn, shed bucks, antlered deer, Does... if it is a deer they will kill it....some nice bucks in the 150/160 range were killed over bait.....this come from an employee of the lake shore....

And who would the "sharpshooters" be?

Pollution, pesticides, lost of habitat and the return of the raptors have pretty much sealed the fate of upland birds here in Indiana. Varmints are another big problem for any nesting birds. With ag land selling for record prices and crops at all time highs, I doubt Hoosier hunters will ever see the return of the upland birds. h.h.

the Government Programs I am familiar with DISCOURAGE marginal and HEL land farmed. The farmers that Dont listen to or believe in the facts figures and scientific evidence put in front of them is the problem not the unavailability of programs that more than make up for crop loss in these areas its a mind set that cant be broken not the lack of funds

From talking to our farmer in the past, he was very much under the impression that certain fed programs led to marginal land being planted. Now, he could have been wrong. On a lease in Jefferson county, a guy plants a field every year and I. 3 out of 4 years he has left it standing. It produces almost nothing. Probably 15 to 20 acres.

Thats what I mean.. Have him get hold of me If he is interested in any help or information I am a Supervisor on the Jefferson SWCD and that's what we do try to hook up the Farmers and Landowners Or anyone who is wanting to help with Soil and Water Conservation, another misunderstood conception is that all the programs are just for Farmers ...not True

Thanks. I'll mention this to him when we see him in April or May.