The men, reasons behind high-powered proposal

The men, reasons behind high-powered proposal By OutdoorsWithDon

http://outdoorswithdon.com/?s=todays-newspaper-column-2

Interesting ..... no agenda my butt ! .... and to the guy that couldnt kill that deer 400yds away with the equipment we have now, well, that's deer hunting... Like I said, the harvest WILL go up, to the detriment of our herd ....

That doesn't surprise me one bit. I know that HPR's were brought up, and discussed strictly WITHIN and between the DNR/NRC when we went through the last round of rule changes when Xguns were brought into full inclusion. They thought there would be too much resistance with both HPR's AND Xguns being included at the same time. So they dropped the HPR's. It has now been brought up again to "test the waters".

I agree with Don on this one, it is about the money to some extent. Our DNR would love the chance to sell another license to hunters.

Mary Ann (quoted in the story) must not be aware high power rifles have nothing to do with hunting ethics and are part of a rich tradition of deer hunting in places like Wisconsin, Northern Michigan, Minnesota, and Kentucky.

Good article written by Don.... And exposure to what is happening time and time again inside of the IDNR and NRC.

Kinda reminds me of when in the last public meeting when Prop #2 and x-bow inclusion was being discussed one last time..... Bryan Poynter, head of the NRC made reference to receiving "over 100 emails from Woody". And we all knew Woody's "one trick pony" agenda for inclusion of crossbows. Made many of us think "people don't send over 100 emails and dialogue with those they don't think they are getting anywhere with".

Would have liked to have seen all those emails exposed to public record.

Again..... The issue that Don brings to the surface as our IDNR is making changes is not so much the change itself...... But HOW the change and the PROCESS of the change that appears to be driven by the same names..... And information twisted or skewed as they pursue their silent but obvious agenda.

The IDNR and NRC has brought this on themselves when they threw out Prop #1...... And the top deer biologist just left that put his signature all over Prop #1..... As he too sees the landscape not changing on how to get things done without hitting a wall/agendas of those same names over and over again.

Dew is correct - I was at that meeting.

So what is their agenda?
To wipe out our deer herd?

I think there is no real agenda but instead it's all about making it easier and selling licenses. Look at the NRC committee makeup and you'll get an idea as to why things go in a certain direction. If that committee was made up of individuals who cherished the "hunt" you might see a different direction. If the management plan was anything other then managing numbers, you might also see a different approach. Wildlife continues to suffer, generally, as society is moving more and more to "money", "job creation" and economic development. Whether folks want to acknowledge or not, in many ways the environment, which then has a direct impact on many wildlife species, is under attack daily from rule changes and such. Go down to the statehouse and talk to legislators and see whether they care about any of this.

All public comments have been released on this proposed change, just wondering why were those emailed comments not released to the public?

Good question......

it wasnt in their "agenda"....

So when did personal emails become public info ???

If there not part of the input process they are not public info... Never have or never will be..... SMH

Still waiting for someone to post the DNR/NRC hidden agenda !!!

POST IT UP.....

Greg. If the emails were addressed to the individual in his or her capacity on the NRC, they are likely discoverable as public.

That maybe true but they don't have to be posted as part of the input process is my point!!!

Yes they can be gotten though a discovery !!!! Iam sure you see a lot folks/names from here on that list also!!!

Deer hunting is all about the bucks, I mean buck$. Even Cabelas sells tractors.

I would imagine that if HPR's are allowed that they would be covered under the current firearms license.

Agreed. I was just pointing out the possibility of getting the information if someone chose to press the issue.

I was talking about public input on the proposal in the form of emails, not personal emails. Personal emails are just that, personal.

That's not what the OP was talking/whining about.....Personal emails was the issue....that's why there not posted!!!

After thinking further on this, I guess I would question the integrity of the process if the members of the committee accepted personal emails on the issue instead of ignoring them or releasing them as a part of the public process. Not that they have to but it does say something about the process. I would suggest that any committee member that allowed such should excuse themselves from the process. Allowing circumvention of the process is unacceptable, IF that was what was happening.

If they were sent to his email that is a public account then they are not personal anymore. I would imagine they were sent to his NRC account.

The @INdnrnews says it will hold three public meetings in March to discuss rule changes including high-powered rifles for deer hunting

Unfortunately, the aspect of holding public meeting is but a mere charade. As we have repeatedly seen lately on a number of issues, it all has very little to do with the "public" but instead pretty much solely has to do with what can be generated in the pursuit of self interest. Having public meetings does nothing but put the DNR in a no win situation. Especially when the NRC is likely to do whatever it wishes regardless of public input or DNR wishes. It borders on pure craziness to hold public meetings that when there is NO real definitive process outlined or apparently followed in regard to how proposed rules comes about, how various aspects of the proposed rules are dealt with, how "data" is meaningfully acquired and assessed and how the outcome of all this will be determined, other then the vote of a few people who seemingly don't even participate in the process. Just insane!!!!

Let's look at the bright side, when HPR's become legal...it will make it easier to kill everything in the CWD endemic zones on our horizon.

Delaney has it correct, in the last change of rule proposals the NRC called a meeting of IDNR and several sportsmen groups. The meeting was held in the evening at a business on the north side of Indy, there was no a quroum of NRC members, just three. Those three NRC members told IDNR exactly how the rules would be changed. This was over objections of the Chief of Fish&Wildlife and the deer biologist along with the sportsmen groups. We could not move gun season, it would then conflict with Illinois gun opener, two of the three NRC members also hunt Illinois!

I was present at that meeting and watched how rule changes REALLY happen. It was the last time I(or will) participate in the proccess.

Not to mention sitting in a Senators Office in the State House with IDNR Brass saying...."But we WANTED the First Proposal!!"

At that point it was quite evident that the IDNR does not run the IDNR......... and the NRC "few" stepped WAY out of bounds, in many ways.

And out of respect for Chad Stewart....... I won't repeat on a public forum what he told me about the meeting Joe is referencing...

If I had to guess, this is one of a handful of reasons Chad bailed and went else where .... he really had no say in management issues ....

Or could be he's making more than twice what he did in Indiana.

Currently, 56 unfilled positions in Fish & Wildlife. Approximately 35 are biologists. Law Enforcement is about 35 short of maximum manpower. Hiring freeze by Gov. Pence.

Jack

This is all really sad. Not surprising, but sad.

It reminds me of when Evan Bayh decided not to run for the senate. He said our government is no longer doing what is in the best interest of the people/country. But instead, every decision is made along party lines. Basically, whichever party has the numbers, shoves all legislation down the throats of the other party and the people.
Now I wasn't a huge Evan Bayh fan, but I believe he was right when he said that.

Our government is not a Democracy...where 51-49 rules. It was founded as a "Republic"...you know, " To the republic for which it stands..."
Our elected officials aren't supposed to do exactly what we say. They are suppose to know what we want, and go to these sessions and represent us. But they are suppose to do what is best for our country/state. If we decide they aren't doing that, we don't re-elect them.

It's so sad that money has taken over not only federal government, but now the IDNR and NRC. They do what THEY want.

If HPR's to become legal, I will not hunt gun season. I don't hunt much now...but I will NOT go out there and subject myself to a guy who bought his Savage 270 for a couple hundred dollars at walmart the night before season and goes out there chucking lead.